Coaching Episode: How to Replace The Energy of Competition With Collaboration (Episode 73)

Melyssa Griffin

27 min

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I’m a former high school teacher turned entrepreneur who loves few things more than a good hug, hopping on a flight to anywhere, and teaching people like you how to live an abundant and limitless life.

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In this Limitless Coaching episode, I have the opportunity to sit down with another phenomenal Mastermind member named Kate. She is a brilliant therapist who comes to the conversation with some fears around being vulnerable in sharing with others what’s not working well in her business. 

As we dive deeper into the conversation, Kate recognizes that her fears are a result of the beliefs she adopted as a child that competition and high performance are the biggest indicators of success and self worth.

If you’ve ever felt like an unsuccessful launch or campaign was a direct reflection on you as a person or you tend to feel shame when it comes to asking for help, then you will probably resonate with Kate’s journey!

During this conversation, I share some ways that Kate can replace the energy of competition with collaboration while she identifies some practices that she can put in place to keep herself open to the possibilities, opportunities and ideas of what could change or be iterated in her next launch or project to get different results.

There are a lot of gems that come out of today’s coaching call and I can’t wait for you to hear all of it. 

Let’s dive in!

Listen to the episode below:

This episode discusses topics like…

  • Kate’s biggest concern with the fears she is having in her business 
  • What she makes it mean about herself when a launch or ad campaign doesn’t go the way that she wanted it to 
  • The role that competition and success from her childhood continues to play today
  • The way Kate has been feeling when she sees success being had by others in her niche, and how I’d like the to shift from competition to collaboration instead 
  • What she believes to be her biggest challenge right now, and my advice for how she can overcome this 
  • Some helpful practices she can incorporate to shift her mindset around success 

By the way, I created an entirely free, 5-day at-home digital retreat called Limitless Entrepreneur. It’s all about creating a new income stream in less than a week, as well as reprogramming the beliefs that are keeping you from a no-limits business and life. Click the image below to sign up, it’s free!
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Did this episode help you expand what’s possible for your life or business? Do you think your social media followers may learn something, too? I’d be forever grateful if you shared it on social media. 🙂 If you do, tag @melyssa_griffin and @limitlesslifepodcast so I can repost you! Woohoo!

I’d love to hear your thoughts on this episode. Are you letting the energy of competition keep you from gaining the insights and support that can move your forward? What is one action that you can do today to become more open to new possibilities and ways of creating?

Thank you SO much for being here, sweet friend. I’m honored to walk this journey with you. See you in the next episode!

xoxo
Melyssa

Read the Episode Transcript Here

Melyssa
So Kate, where do you want to start today?

Kate
Okay, so when I thought about what would be most useful, it was kind of like feelings that came up actually. And I try to listen to those instead of thinking through it. So the feelings that are coming up for me with my business are like they’re kind of fearful. This fearful narrative of what if this doesn’t work? And it’s, it’s really familiar, and it’s I’ve been feeling it for a while for years. And I’m aware that it’s like a part of myself, it’s not the full picture. But every once in a while, it gets big and loud and, and I think my biggest concern is that it impacts my mood. I noticed I struggle personally, when I’m losing confidence in my business, and so there’s something in there around my My gosh around, I mean separating it a bit. Although the work that I do is I love it, it’s meaningful, I care about the impact. So it’s, I mean, my goal isn’t to separate it completely because I do care. But I noticed the impact on my life in such a major way when something doesn’t work out as I thought it would, or I launched something or I, you know, put something out there and I don’t get the response. It feels so personal. So and something that this message that I you know, came across lately in our in the mastermind actually was at, you are not your launch, you are not your product, you are not your sales, you are not your revenue. And like I totally get that and I’m a cognitive level. But the way it feels when I put something out there, even on a small scale of like, here’s a challenge I’m offering who wants to sign up I feel so vulnerable and then if I don’t get signups I feel awful. Yeah, and even as I say that it feels kind of embarrassing. It feels like young, but it’s really strong. And so that is what I was hoping. Because I’ve got and yeah,

Melyssa
Maybe it is young. Right?

Kate
Yeah.

Melyssa
Yeah. The fact that it’s young.

Kate
Exactly, exactly. And I think that’s the familiarity of like, this isn’t a new feeling. But I can see that it’s, it’s not entirely useful. Yeah. So there’s something something in that this idea of like, I am not my launch, but emotionally, like it feels like I am. And so to me, that brings up questions of like worthiness around work and career and what am I doing with my life, all of that. So I know those are big questions, but I, it’s hard to separate or to tease it out. So yeah, looking for some guidance with that.

Melyssa
So what do you make it mean about yourself? When a launch doesn’t go the way that you wanted it to? What are some of the stories you tell yourself?

Kate
Hmm, yeah, it’s interesting because like, the thoughts that come up right away are like, this isn’t gonna work. It’s me. I’ve had like embarrassed embarrassment, actually. So that’s what makes it feel quite young is this like, vulnerability, and then embarrassment. Maybe it’s a bit of the like, see, and you couldn’t do it. Or you saw kind of like basic put downs that, you know, they’re not sophisticated. It’s like, it’s this kind of shameful, like, you aren’t good at this. Yeah. And even things like most recently, so this a few days ago, I put out a Facebook ad and even that, I’m like, my ad isn’t converting, I suck. This is so embarrassing. And so I know my wife self like I can kind of shift into my more mature self And I can look at that and say, well, that’s not true. Like that’s a Facebook ad. I am not an ad designer. Maybe that’s the problem. But it feels so personal. And it feels embarrassing. And so what happened just a few days ago is the VA who’s supporting me said, Well, I could take a look at your ads. I’m really happy to kind of look through it all. And my first reaction was like, you I’m not sure I knew that it was like, and I still haven’t shown it to her. I just cut that off. Like that’s not happening. And it was just automatic. And then just exploring, reflecting on that for myself realizing what is that about this shame or embarrassment? That it’s not good enough?

Melyssa
Mm hmm. There’s so much there that we can unpack together. In a beautiful way.

Kate
Yeah.

Melyssa
Yeah. What first speaks to me is how you mentioned this word young and how young the voice sounds when it tells you all these negative things about yourself. That you should be embarrassed. See I know you couldn’t do it, you suck. It’s like this fifth grade version of you telling you things to yourself. And that voice that has all those negative things to say by yourself isn’t ever you, right? It’s like the programming, the conditioning, the things that we’ve heard that we’ve adopted as us. So it’s interesting to me that the voice sounds so young. That makes me think when did you start to adopt that voice as yours and where did it come from? Do you have any sense of that?

Kate
Yeah I’m trying to locate I mean, it’s been with me for so long, like it’s a competitive driving voice that like little, I’m picturing like, seven, like young I guess it’s kind of just always been there. Yeah. It’s this really clear sense of like, if you’re not really good, then you should be ashamed of yourself. Yeah. If you’re not Who? Yeah, like, it’s so simple, it’s so like, basic, like it’s so young and not nuanced. It’s just like you just has to be really good. You have to be the best, probably that that kind of language like. And if you’re not, that’s really embarrassing, shameful. Yeah. I mean, I can, like I’m seeing my little sporty self as a young person, you know, and I was really competitive and always and successful in always as a young person, with sports and academics and everything. And so, I think, I mean, I could draw straight line probably to learning that way of being of like, this is a good way to be and you get a lot of things when you are good at stuff. You know,

Melyssa
What do you get when you feel good?

Kate
You feel when I say you, and I’m thinking of like my seven year old self. She felt important and so like the word successful, she felt successful. But what does that get her? I mean, I suppose my dad really loved that. I love that like it. You know, I think being good at things as a younger person felt like it was expected. I enjoyed it felt kind of natural as well. So it wasn’t painful then it was fun. It was like, so it’s not like I had this childhood with parents who were just drilling me into doing things like I thrived with that, I really liked it. I loved being on teams. I loved being competitive. So it was joyful. Yeah. So as I like, reflect on it, it wasn’t. It didn’t feel like a negative pressure. It was like a very encouraging kind of environment that I learn to be that way, if that makes sense.

Melyssa
Yeah. And was it joyful to compete? Or was it joyful to succeed in the competing?

Kate
I think it was joyful to…well, I think it was both To be honest, because I always played like, I often think of sports, I always played on teams. My teams weren’t always the best. Like we didn’t win everything. But I think, personally, I always felt like I always felt good enough for more than good enough. You know, I always felt comfortably in the kind of top performing athletes, right. So I think maybe on an individual level, there was that sense of winning, right. So, you know, I guess I wasn’t always successful in like the, you know, the way that a team would look at that, but I felt good enough. I never felt insecure in my abilities. That makes sense. Yeah.

Melyssa
You didn’t have to necessarily when you were seen as one of the top players and a leader on the team and that felt so stressful enough?

Kate
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I enjoy that. Yeah, I really enjoyed that. But I can see like the culture that I grew up in was, like cared a lot about that, like that status. Yeah. So I feel that on a deep level, like, what do you have to show for your success?

Kate
Was there ever anyone in your family you didn’t have a lot to show for their success? Not very many people. And I think if they didn’t, it was because they rebelled. And they were like, fuck it I don’t believe in that anyway, but they were totally capable of meeting the standards. That we learned were important. So yeah, it wasn’t just me. But my, just the way I was my abilities that really probably had little to do with me just the way I was born. I happen to be good at the things that my family values And so it was easy for me to just like, play into the all of that, you know? Yeah.

Melyssa
For those people who rebelled Are there any stories that you picked up about them? And the fact that they weren’t subscribing to the culture of your family?

Kate
Yeah, I mean, they. So from my younger selves perspective, they were bad. They were disappointing and they were doing it wrong. Yeah, I had this feeling that I’m the youngest of three daughters. And I feel like I learned how to do it right. Until like, I think my dad was really proud of me. I know he still is, but I know he really was when I was younger, like I was, you know, doing all the things that he really valued, and I valued and we had a really nice day. connection. And I witness that connection with my siblings to capture because I don’t know if they either weren’t able to do it the same way I could or chose not to, or combination of both. But I sort of like witnessed all of that and then was really good at doing it. Right. And so, when I was younger, I felt like it was easier for me. things worked out, you know what I mean? Like it is kind of figured it out, like how to how to be good night, you know?

Melyssa
Yeah, can I reflect something.

Kate
Yes, please.

Melyssa
So, when you were a kid, you learned that when you were succeeding, when you were a top performer, when you were being good, then you felt important. You felt like your dad, loved you. Maybe even the most You felt that you felt joyful, you felt good enough, you felt all these things that create confidence and happiness and belonging, connection. And then you also simultaneously witness these other people who sort of are like your peers in your family, your siblings, and they didn’t really subscribe to that same system that you did. You learned how to outsmart the system. And they, for whatever reason, chose not to be part of it. And you saw that they were considered bad and disappointing. They’re doing it wrong. And as a seven year old, I would think our kid that you picked up on some energy that gave you those definitions, maybe energy from your dad or parents, family school that made you think like, Oh, I’m doing it right. I’m important and successful and they’re doing it wrong. Because they’re being treated differently or something about this different. And so you basically learned that when I’m not doing it right when I’m not good, then I’m like them, I don’t get the same love, especially from this like godly person who is the creator of me, you know, which represents a lot, then, then I’m bad. And so now you’re in this place in your business where you’re embarking on new territory. And it can be a little messy. And you don’t always feel like a top performer. And it’s like, what the hell man? I’m a top performer. I know, and now I’m, I feel like I’m not and I hate that feeling. Because all these people should know this about me and I’m the successful one. And then it brings up all these feelings, potentially of like, well, Am I bad? Am I disappointing? Am I not good enough? Yeah, can be really scary.

Kate
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And like I think again, fear, fear is like a big one fear of like, what does this mean? Now if I, why isn’t this working like this simple phrase of is this not going to work? Or why isn’t this working? So first of all this expectation that I have that it should be working better than it is, so it’s not good enough. Even though I know part of me knows that things are growing and it actually is expanding and it’s going well, like I can confidently feel that but this other feeling kind of takes over like, this is not good enough. And it feels scary. It feels like like I’ve often said to my partner, I have this emotional feeling of like hanging on by like my fingers, fingernails even. Like that’s the felt sense of it. It’s hard to explain more than that, but it’s like yeah, Like, hang on to feeling good about it. And it’s like, if I don’t get enough feedback without it good, then I start to feel that again. I was like, Oh, fuck. That’s that. What if losing confidence?

Melyssa
Mm hmm. Here’s the weird double edged sword of being good at everything is that you didn’t necessarily learn what it feels like to have to feel bad at something for a little while, or not even bad. Just to not be where you want to be. And to sit in that discomfort of I can still be worthy and growing.

Kate
Yeah, exactly. What I’ve noticed it’s just popped up right now and I, I feel like when images just pop up that I want to share them. I hope you’re holding on to that. And it’s kind of embarrassing to say, but I think it’s important. So sometimes when I observe other people in my niche in particular, when I witnessed them succeeding, or doing something that I want to do, I feel instant, like, just just embarrassment and shame and like it’s a big feeling. It’s it’s hard to feel abundant. It’s hard to trust that there’s enough space for me when I see somebody else doing something really well. I feel small and scared, and mad. Like all these emotions that are sort of surprising to me. seems interesting, but to a point where I’m like, I cannot follow this person on Instagram, for example, because every time I see them post, I feel shitty about myself. Like, and it’s not true. This person has done nothing wrong. They don’t even know who I am. But it’s this like automatic and again, it feels immature. I feel threatened when I witness other people succeed. And I also then judged that because I hate that feeling, I don’t want to feel that way. But it’s happening. Yeah, even like massive people that I have almost like no right comparing myself to so there’s like a bit of that as well. It’s like, why is that person making me feel? They’re not making me Why am I feeling threatened as a result of witnessing their greatness thing to do with me? But I take it personally.

Melyssa
Yeah, well make sense. Growing up in the culture of competition. You mentioned competing in competition a lot. It’s like competition is the pie is only so big. And there’s only so many trophies and so many number ones, you know? Yeah. So the solution I see to that is shifting to collaboration, and what that could look like it can feel I think collaboration is more of the energy of like, this giant pie. There’s no end to it.

Kate
Yeah, yeah. To me, like, what comes up right away is focusing on impact, like in terms of getting, you know, focusing on business right now, like the impact that I want to have, I really care about the impact. And when I start focusing on that, then then collaboration feels exciting because it’s like, yes, let’s help these women who I’m supporting. That is what I deeply care about. I don’t care if it’s me or you or her, that’s helping her as long as she gets the help. So focusing on impact helps me shift into a place that I want to be in. I’m just aware of those like gut reactions that feel like it’s all part of this. Yeah. So I think like my biggest challenge is how to not take it on in such a deep way that shifts my mood, like how do I how do I not feel so down emotionally when only 50 people sign up for my webinar and I wanted 200 like things like that I don’t want that to affect my mood and my patience with my children and my, like the way I’m feeling all day long and my ability to sleep and like it, just it, the impact is feels too big. And I don’t know how to let it go.

Melyssa
Can I share a thought, Yeah, please. I feel like when when that happens, and we’ve sort of entangled ourselves into our business, or our businesses basically us when something doesn’t go right, then we feel like shit.

Kate
Mm hmm.

Melyssa
And so when we can find those threads, and then like, untie them. And what that can look like is, well, one other thing that I’ll say is that when we do that, we don’t allow feedback. We don’t allow ourselves to iterate on what we’ve done and then shift things for the future because then it’s so personal that it’s like, we kind of close off and are able to see the possibilities of what could change or be iterated for next time to get different results. So it’s Like, when you put your webinar signups on, you get 50 people instead of 200. A remembering that they’re not signing up because they like you or not, they’re signing up, or the topic or the way that it was messaged, or the way an email was written or, you know, like, the way a Facebook ad graphic looked, and actually just digging into what is the reason why this didn’t work beyond just the fact that I suck, because that’s not it. That’s not it at all. Yeah, yeah. And then when you can start to accept feedback, and really, like, list out the potential reasons why something isn’t working, then you get to see, okay, it’s actually not about me. And it’s not even about me, having done a shitty job messaging my webinar. It’s like, business and life is about iterating. It’s never a linear thing. It’s always like ah, you try this and then that leads you to this and then that leads you to that. And so you’re constantly just experimenting until you find something that works. So I think it’s also getting comfortable with that. experimentation instead of thinking that you need to have it all figured out right now and that if you don’t, then there’s something wrong with you. Mm hmm. Really, you just need to try something, see how it goes, and then iterate for the next stage of trying it again. And I keep doing that. Whenever we launch something. We always make changes to the next launch. And I’ve launched so many times over the years now, but it’s like, we’ll always continue learning what doesn’t doesn’t work. Mm hmm. And it’s kind of like finding the joy in that. You get to beat your own records. And you get to experiment and have fun instead of like, Oh, this sucks. Like, I suck.

Kate
Yeah, yeah. And that’s, that’s exactly the shift I think I need is well a, not jumping from low enrollment to I suck, like recognizing that there’s a whole bunch of other possibilities before or I suck or taking I suck off the table completely. But maybe first step is recognizing that there’s like, there’s a lot of other reasons people didn’t sign up. So I think for me, just like noticing how quickly I jumped to that conclusion, and then that urge to just, like, close that tab on my business and build something else, because it brings up that shame. Right? So instead of like running away from that shame, being willing to show my VA like, look at the numbers, you know, even this past week, she’s like, how many people signed up for the challenge I’m doing right now and I feel like embarrassed saying it, even though it’s actually fine. Like it’s good and I’m enjoying the challenge and I’m you know, so it’s, it’s that possibly, like, bravery, willingness to just say, where I’m at

Melyssa
Yeah

Kate
like there’s something about confronting that. That is scary to me. Like when people ask me, how many clients do you have right now? You know, how many people signed like they they’re, I don’t know if you people still ask you stuff like that but like many people to sign up for your mastermind like for me when people ask me that I feel judged I feel this like evaluation happening. That’s the fear is like, are you judging me? But also, I guess I’m judging myself because even when I’m quietly in my room looking at numbers myself, I feel that as well. So anyway, when you mentioned accepting feedback that feels really important, being willing to stay open, after I am vulnerable, that phase of openness to learning, and like, searching for possibilities other than I suck, like, what might those be? Yeah,

Melyssa
Yeah. And I’m see I’m still seeing this vision of looking for the threads of competition in your thinking. And shifting them to collaboration. Even your VA asking how many challenge signups and you not wanting to share that competition says don’t share it unless we exceeded our goal and she’s gonna, or she or he is going to see me as this amazing business owner collaboration says, I’m going to share it with her and if we hit the goal, yay, we celebrate together. And if we haven’t hit the goal yet, then I share it with my VA and we come up with ideas together on how we can hit the goal to inviting people into the process instead of holing yourself up and thinking that you have to be the one with all the answers.

Kate
Mm hmm. Yeah, I love that. Because that is how I feel like hiding, I guess holing up sales hiding, right? Like, I’m only like, I guess the belief would be I can only share when I can only let people know when it’s good. Or when I’m meeting those expectations.

Melyssa
Hmm, right on the Facebook ads, too.

Melyssa
Yeah, it’s the same feeling. Mm hmm. Yeah. And thinking about maybe that’s part of what’s not working, or what’s not getting you to the place that you want to be in right now, is that business isn’t really meant to be just run by one person. There’s so much innovation, and strategy and success that comes from having the diversity of opinions and thoughts and feedback and experience.

Kate
Mm hmm. That’s one thing that I’ve just really appreciated about the mastermind actually, is that idea of growing your pot to and, you know, growing it before your plant, just like gets rebound and dies, but also acknowledging like, why would I think that I need to be a bomb Facebook strategist, and a designer and a therapist and know how to run a frickin team like, I don’t know. How to do these things. But I expect that I’m going to nail all of them. Like I laugh at that, because I know how ridiculous that is. But that is the the expectation is like, yeah, I’m going to be good at all these. I’m gonna design my website, I’m going to be the one. Like, literally until last week, I have been doing all my web stuff. Like, it’s bizarre. I know that, that I’m holding myself to those expectations. So yeah, that’s another piece of like, almost compassionate. Why would I expect myself to be an expert in all of these fields? I can ask for help. It’s okay that I created a Facebook ad. That’s not great. Why would I have expected otherwise?

Melyssa
People have full careers on

Kate
Yeah, I make one and I’m like pissed off that I didn’t get a bunch of clicks. Yeah, yeah. So do you sounds like you, part of this would be like, literally practicing every time I feel that closing, hiding, you know, like concealing feeling of keeping things, you know, hidden from my VA or my whoever else, kind of leaning into the feedback and learning, practicing that.

Melyssa
Hey, limitless listener. We’ll get back to the show in just a moment. But I wanted to take 20 seconds to invite you to the free at home digital retreat that I created just for you. It’s called limitless entrepreneur and it’s all about helping you to create an abundant, fearless mindset, all while growing your online business. You want to join just visit limitless entrepreneur retreat.com to register. It’s totally free. That’s limitless entrepreneur. retreat.com. All right, friend back to the show.

Melyssa
Yep. And what’s a word? I don’t know if it is collaboration, but a word like that. When you’re starting to feel this competition, this withdrawing a word or something that can remind you to lean, lean deeper into connection support.

Kate
Hmm, that’s a good question. I’m trying to think of something, something around like, it feels like brave, it feels scary. So it feels like it would take bravery. It’s just it’s a different kind of bravery for me because the comfort zone bravery would be to like, head down, push through, do scary things, do all the things like that is more in my comfort zone. But bravery in asking for help. And saying like, I actually don’t know how to do this. In saying can you look at my copy and tell me what you think like all of those small little steps of reaching out and asking for help feel really vulnerable for me. I’m really brave to put your head down and try to do it all. yourself first not just coming from a place of fear, fear of being a sickness, not the top dog. But yeah, it’s totally coming from fear. That’s not brave. Like vulnerability is brave. For me comfort zone would be like grinding. hustling. Mm hmm. showing everybody that I’m really good. And not showing them the struggle.

Melyssa
Mm hmm.

Kate
And I say that tongue in cheek because clearly, I’m really good at all the things yeah, so great. Like, I guess I want the word feels right bravery, but not in like a strength power house bravery, but in a vulnerability, like, willing to be vulnerable. Yeah, so that’s like the action. I think that I need that willing, that that the stance almost like an openness, a willingness to be vulnerable. And I feel like I need another piece of Around not taking on not not feeding into that unworthiness storyline. But maybe that’ll come as I practice being supportive, even like, as I am vulnerable, maybe I’ll actually receive some support. Wouldn’t that be nice?

Melyssa
And I think when we do that, too, when we’re vulnerable and seen in our vulnerability, it actually feeds that part of ourselves that feels unworthy, because it starts to soothe that part that thinks I’m only worthy when I’m valuable and creating amazing things and they’re successful. And then when people see us in our mess sometimes and they still love us and they still show up, then it’s like, oh, you’re okay, maybe I am worthy. I think it would start to suit.

Kate
Oh, yeah. Yeah, that’s such a good point. Yeah. Like giving myself an opportunity to be loved and supported regardless of success, right? Like, like giving people a chance or giving myself a chance to feel that and to rewrite the story. Now you can see how self protective it is, you know, to like only show up, only be seen if I’m firing and all cylinders like that. I will not only allow people to see me in that way. And I just like perpetuates that expectation. Like, yeah, yeah.

Melyssa
Because then you only get love when you’re performing that way because you’re only opening yourself up to love when you’re performing that way. So you just unconsciously train yourself. I haven’t found that way to get love by just going to try the alternative, just being loved for who you are without needing to perform or achieve. And then that’s when you get 50 people who sign up for your webinar and the goal was 200 You feel fine about it. Like, okay, what do we get to change? Not just me, but collectively what can we talk about? How can we use this as feedback?

Kate
Mm hmm. It’s interesting. I’ve had some experiences lately because I’ve this thing comes up all the time, like, literally all the time because I’m constantly offering different programs and things, right. There’s just so many opportunities to feel like, Am I good? I may not be successful. I may not. Recently I ran a group, like a therapeutic group for pregnant women. And the enrollment was lower than I thought it was that I had that I had envisioned. It was about a quarter. And I was disappointed. I felt embarrassed all these feelings, right. And then I ran the group and I loved it. Like I loved the group. I felt so connected to these women. It was perfect. The numbers worked out perfectly. It was intimate. I look forward to it every week. I felt like the felt worth my time or my business perspective to just felt so good. And it was such a neat experience of like, this expectation that I thought I needed to hit a certain marker for it to feel good enough and valuable. And it wasn’t even close to that. But it was still really good. And it was still a highlight of my week, every week. And so, that’s another thing I want to remember. I’ve had a lot of those experiences too. Like even in this challenge. I’m running right now. So there’s, you know, 57 people in my challenge. And I last week as I was planning it, I was thinking, Okay, that’s putting a lot of energy into this as a lot of work. And now there’s only 57 people and that was disappointing, but this week, there’s just like so much engagement and I’m really enjoying getting to know these women and it’s fun and I’m really, I feel proud of them. I feel like some of the things they’re doing. So it’s surprising me like the joy that I’m getting out of it is surprising. It’s totally different than what I would have thought But I did think so. Yeah, I’m recognizing that, even though it doesn’t go to like what my younger, super driven part of self wants, it doesn’t mean it’s bad, like I still might actually really love when it doesn’t go to plan. That makes sense.

Melyssa
Yeah, there’s this expectation sometimes that we all have, that it needs to be a financial success or to be successful. There’s so many forms of success. And I think it would be helpful for you to maybe journal about or write down what does success actually look like and feel like how do you know that you’re successful? Because financial success is one part. And if you only have that part, then it doesn’t create the joy and the fulfillment and all of the other things that actually matter that actually create a meaningful life. I did a launch almost a year ago. program and the program was, I think the smallest launch that I’ve ever done. I think we are in like, I don’t know if this will sound smaller, big, but I think we earned around $10,000, which is actually smaller than the first launch I’ve ever done five years ago. by yourself. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, my very first course. So it was like, Whoa, okay, that didn’t work. Well, yeah, then I need to look deeper into it. And I ran the course it was a new program. And a big part of the program was that I was doing coaching like this and getting to, to coach people on a deeper level. And I hadn’t really done that before. And so that program, despite it being not a huge financial success, we basically broke even if you can, an ads and all the things that led to me creating this podcast in this format that I hadn’t seen anyone to do before doing coaching episodes, and it led me to launch the master mind which has a lot of coaching components. And that was a half a million dollar launch. And it’s like, if I had stopped at the course, because I thought, well, this sucks, I suck. And this wasn’t a success, then it wouldn’t have inspired me to start these other things that are so much more aligned, and financially successful, fulfilling, successful. So I think sometimes we get hung up on every single thing we do has to be this smashing success. But I think if we go into the things that we do, thinking, what’s here, that’s teaching me something that’s leading me where I need to go. And that’s where I think the real juiciness is. Because it’s all teaching us something. It’s all leading us somewhere if we’re like, open to receiving that direction.

Kate
Yes, absolutely. I can just see I just underlined the word open, accepting like it feels similar to that. Accepting feedback, being willing to look at it that way instead of just like Big F on your paper you submitted. It’s like, you know something about that. Good for you and yeah, but can I ask you a question?

Melyssa
Yeah.

Kate
Do you still feel any of that like, paying of shittiness when you have that launch and then had to like work looking at it in this way or does it in this in this way of like, Okay, how can we make this better?

Melyssa
I don’t feel shitty about the launch. I actually feel like it was one of the best things I did last year. I’m so grateful that I did it genuinely because it led me literally Yeah, things that matter the most to me in my business in my life now so,

Kate
But I guess I’m asking like at the time did you feel that pain because what I’m curious about like I’m hoping I can get to that that’s my goal right to get to that point and to see it right away is like, oh, no one signed up. Okay, what needs to change instead of like, Oh my god, I feel worse. So doesn’t wondering about that. If you ever feel it

Melyssa
Hmm, I think in the beginning, like before the program started, it was a live program for maybe four weeks. And I think maybe the first few days after the car closed, or during the launch or something I was feeling like, this didn’t really go the way I thought it was going to go. About Me as like, I suck What the heck is wrong with me, but more of like, Okay. According to plan to the drawing board, right, right, right. So it was more of like the feedback of like, this didn’t work the way I thought it would. But then when I started doing the program, and feeling all the things of like, wow, I actually love doing this. Then I started to get it. I was like, okay, wasn’t really about this being like a smashing success, it was leading me somewhere. But yeah, in the beginning, I did feel a little bit of that, like, I wish I would have worked out really, you know, but I don’t really make it mean something about me. It’s more of like, let’s debrief in and figure out what’s not working here.

Kate
Yeah. Nice. Yeah.

Melyssa
I wanted to also mention we were talking about being open versus kind of feeling closed off if something doesn’t go according to plan, and I see it as an energy too. Or it’s like if something doesn’t go the way that you want it to, and then you shut off or you turn away from it, or you don’t want to tell anyone about it, then there’s this energy flow that’s happening, and then it stops. So the energy and the momentum and the iteration, just like it’s cut off, because you’re cut off. But when you start to open up, even when it’s like, I don’t want to I don’t want to tell anyone, I don’t want to have to sit with this. I don’t want to feel this. When you just stay open, then you’re allowing that energy to continue circulating. And that’s the only way that you continue to grow and get to the next level and the next level is by having that energy staying open because that’s where the possibility and ideas and the let’s turn this program into a mastermind or a podcast comes from but when you’re closed, it’s like, Well, that didn’t go according to plan. So F that and start something different, you know?

Kate
Yes. Yeah, I’m so glad you said that. Because I have had this feeling of like energy is how I would have described it. I do describe it as energy, just kind of like dumping out. And then when something doesn’t go to plan, or if I don’t feel, you know, good enough with how things went. And I pivot, which is comfort zone, right? Like, hey, what am I going to create? Now, instead of being open to digging more into it, it’s temporarily relieving, but over time, I have felt just so depleted like I am dumping energy out and this feeling of like, for what like for what this isn’t working, and it’s just dumping and I feel tired. So when you said that it just made me wonder about that piece of like, continuing that flow. Instead of cutting it off, letting it continue and turn into something or at least see something through and allow it to shift. Yeah, I don’t know if you think that those two feelings might be connected, but that strong sense I’ve had, I’ve just like dumping energy out. And then wondering like, what am I going to feel like something’s coming back, right?

Melyssa
Yeah, well, not 100% I get that and it’s like, I’m like a feeling of treading water here, just staying afloat, but not really hanging on to something long enough for it to turn into something tangible. Think it’s like you’re running a marathon on a mountain, and there’s a bunch of rocks and twigs and branches in your way. So you could either run in this like, zigzag weird, like you’re not actually going anywhere. You’re just like running in one direction. The other direction that’s like, okay, you’re not really getting anywhere, right? And then if you try to run more, and like, align, even with there are branches in your way and rocks and there’s obstacles. It’s like you’re still actually getting somewhere. You might not be comfortable, but you get better at it.

Kate
Yeah.

Melyssa
And then you don’t feel like you’re treading water, you start to make some real progress up the mountain.

Kate
Like that metaphor. Yeah, like in treading water too. I mean, not what I said earlier around, like hanging on, I fit this a similar feeling of like, Okay, I’m kind of getting tired here. I’m hanging in there, but I need a little need something a little help. Yeah. It feels really clear to me. Right now, like the one major piece standing out to me is an openness to vulnerability. Right and like, maybe even just being mindful of how I’m closing myself off in those moments, those like really specific things like when I open up my ads manager and look at things like in that exact moment. You mindful of like, what’s happening? How am I closing myself off? How am I hiding in that hole? And what what would actually allow me to be supported right now instead of continuing to project this, like, it’s all good when Meanwhile, I’m like secretly terrified. Right? So how could I? Yeah, in that exact moment, connect instead of retract?

Melyssa
Hmm. Is there some practice you could create that would help you to see that?

Kate
Mm hmm. Yeah. And I really like visual aids. I have a lot of things. I mean, this is ironic. I have an affirmation that I created. I made the case. These is this is an opt in for the moms I support. And it says my worth is not defined by success or achievement. I am deeply valuable because of the person I am not for what I accomplish. Yeah, so and I have this sitting in like, tucked in my monitor. So visual aids would be helpful, maybe even more mindfully looking at things instead of just like checking opt ins or like checking social shares or things like that. It’s like I’m looking for that validation, and maybe doing it more strategically, like, why am I looking at the opt ins right now? And what am I going to do about that? Would you say to me, instead of just like checking randomly to, like self soothe or something not sure. So for example, I don’t know maybe when I open up the ads manager, it’s like, okay, what am I doing with this? And then what am I gonna do with that information that you asked about? Is there a queue?

Melyssa
What about like, when you you notice your webinar has 50 signups and your goal was 200, what could you do in a moment like that?

Kate
I think I could. Honestly, I think like what’s coming to me is a self compassion practice that I do, which is, when I say I do, I clearly need to expand into this terrain. But it’s like noticing the discomfort like just noticing the feeling of that. First, and then becoming when I’m mindfully aware of it, then I can see it, instead of being it right, I can witness it. Like, oh my gosh, I feel so ashamed right now, or embarrassed or shitty, or whatever it is. And then trying to connect to that, like, we talked about the 50 options in between the data, and I suck, like trying to connect with all of those other possibilities of why I didn’t meet my goal. So it could just be even a simple mantra that I could come up with it like, this isn’t because of me, as a human. I’m struggling. But this idea yeah, this idea of like, decentering it for me like it’s not me. It’s not my fault. In a way. This is a problem that I could solve. I don’t know anything coming to you?

Melyssa
Yeah, I think first I like the mindfulness of just feeling what’s there. Sort of detaching the feeling from you too, it’s kind of like you can feel and see the emotion. Yes, there. It’s not you. It’s just, it’s its own thing. And you get to have a relationship with that thing. But it’s not you.

Kate
Yeah, well, what just came to me actually, that I know is is helpful for all sorts of things I teach my clients this and I love it is like, reminding yourself of what part of you is bringing that feeling. Right. Like, in that moment, as I look at my lead pages, analytics, it’s like, I feel embarrassed. And then I notice it and that’s my eight year old self that’s like, Oh my god, I’m not good enough. Like that’s a little part of me. Right. And I, I know for me when I when I can see that when I acknowledge that then I’m like, oh, wow, yeah, of course you feel that way because you don’t know yet that you’re actually really worthy. And it’s not about like, Is it my whole tone, change? Right, it’s like, yeah, you feel crappy because that’s what you’ve learned. But that’s not how we need to feel like, let’s look into this. So it’s just like a tapping into that compassionate place of like, not buying into the emotion fully, but witnessing it and understanding that it comes from that little part of me that just didn’t know any better, who’s just doing her best and makes a lot of sense that she learned to feel that way, you know? Yeah. So as soon as I am aware of that even right now, I’m like, Oh, yeah, like it’s totally shift. So I need to I feel like that would be a really useful cue. Gosh, maybe I should put a little picture of myself on the corner of my thing.

Melyssa
Do you wanna see my phone screen. Oh, do you have let me see. Well, it’s on Do Not Disturb but Oh, the little picture of me. I was just a me when I was like three. Similar reminder.

Kate
Oh, wow.

Melyssa
Yeah, remembering little me.

Kate
Yeah, it makes goosebumps right now. Because it’s so powerful. Like, that’s why we hustle. That’s why we do our patterns that aren’t that helpful. Yeah, yeah.

Melyssa
To your practice is a practice that I do sometimes when I’m feeling, feeling that way feeling just triggered or scared. I’ll close my eyes and visualize the little me like you’re talking about. I’ll ask her what she needs and I’ll give her the love that she needed in that moment and just make her feel really safe and seen. And then when she starts to feel more seen and less triggered and more happy and and all of the things then she can leave. And then I invited my higher self. Why is part of me that is capable of accepting feedback and making changes and doing the brave thing and being bold. Trouble and being seen in my mess and all of those things. So I invite that person in. And I asked them, like, how should I feel right now? How do I get to act? What can I do in this situation? And then I just take their advice, because they’re usually the most intuitive, highest, less ego, part of me that is capable of making the hard choices and doing the brave things. And then I feel so much better. Usually when I do that.

Kate
Mm hmm. Yeah. Beautiful. Yeah. Because that part of you that is calling for you in that moment, that little part, gets what she needed, right? Yeah. So it’s not like a dismissal of her. It’s like, I’m here. I see you. I give you what you need. And you’re free and you’re not deciding how we feel. It’s like that inviting, wise part. I love that. I think that’s what I need. I I have in my other space in my home have a box of photographs I’m I’m just recently gave to me and like young ones that I think I need to find one and put it in the corner of my monitor. And yeah, it’s helpful to compassion. Like I understand the hustle, right like I get it. And I think what I, what that part of you would need to hear is like, you don’t have to worry like you don’t have to work that hard. You don’t have to. You can relax. If you’ve heard me talk about how I want ease and fun in my life like No wonder. No, that’s like been my word for so many years to my words ease joy or ease and fun. I think it’s it’s probably all overlaps of like, it’s hard to feel at ease and fun when you feel like you can’t stop you and really doesn’t a little girl want to have ease and fun. Isn’t it perfect. Uh huh. I feel like so tender right now. And they think that’s probably that little part. Maybe feeling seen. I just I feel it feels like slow and just comforting. Feels like relaxing. Yeah. The opposite of like frantic you know feels like phew, yeah. Thank you I think this is like what I think we yeah, this is what I’m needing for sure to see it you know, it’s hard to see it like when your heads down and you’re hustling. Yeah to like stop and see what what’s happening, you know?

Melyssa
Yeah, you’re going so fast. Seems like it’s inviting you to go a little slower. Bring more people in for the ride.

Kate
Mm hmm. Yeah.

Melyssa
Mmm. You did such a great job.

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